A MOC - Kragled

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dr_spock
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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by dr_spock » Sun Apr 27, 2014 4:54 pm

How is Kragle working? Have you tried a solvent like acetone that melts ABS plastic or ABS cement?

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:35 am

I tried ABS cement, but used too much of it & found it melted tiles in alarming ways. I wasn't pleased w/ the results. Loctite Plastic Epoxy sets too fast, and JB Weld is a mess, and you can't be sure you're mixing it in the correct ratio. (1:1) I tried super glue on this last part, and other than nearly sticking to the tube myself, I think it's probably the easiest to work with. I plan to shoot it this week, so we'll see how it holds up.

ETA: Super Glue is also quite cheap. I'll likely only use 2 part epoxies in the future when I need bulk, such as around a carbine buffer tube. It's also, apparently, evil, which makes it mo' bettah, right? ;-)

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Sat May 10, 2014 4:58 pm

Cragelized for the upcoming 00 buck torture test, back to Version 5A:

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... gVer5A.jpg

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Mon May 12, 2014 3:30 pm

30 rounds of Remington 12 ga 00 buck:

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... eTake4.3gp

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by stevebuscemi » Mon May 12, 2014 6:32 pm

Sounds like a good toy for kids to play with. Well done.

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Fri May 16, 2014 1:41 pm

I think of it more as a bonding opportunity for parents & their children - depending on who's holding the Kragle, it can be more or less of a bonding experience ; )

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:51 pm

Well, the moment quite a few of y'all have been waiting for: failure!

On the 2nd round of 12 ga 3" 00, the lower part of the 5C stock sheared off the top part; unfortunately for my shoulder, I didn't stop shooting 'til the 8th round. Ouch!

The video: http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... eTake5.mp4

For comparison, here is the much longer, heavier, and sturdier Ver 5B, running 30 rounds of 2.75" 00 buck:

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... eTake4.3gp

Pics of 5C failure points:

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... r5cAar.jpg

Note in this picture, the Kragle held - but the bump sheared off clean under the recoil:

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... ailure.jpg

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... cShear.jpg

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... ailure.jpg

Some reinforcement will go here. Instead of using a brick in the column, I'll use several plates, some of which will anchor the 4x4 inverse slope brick:

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... cement.jpg

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... ailure.jpg

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... embled.jpg

Glue for the stock itself was a generic super glue. The glue between the mil-spec tube and the stock was JB Weld 2 part epoxy; due to some voids in the bricks, that is the glue you see that has bled through the top part.

Technical suggestions appreciated. My current plan of action, suggested by Zuzzy on Weaponeer.net, is to lengthen the column by one brick, creating a vertical shaft. Interlaced through there I'll run plates w/ center holes, then run a screw from top to bottom. Following gluing of the stock, I'll tighten that down. Then the 2-part epoxy will be added into the buffer tube well, of which the top of the bolt will be at the rear. The buffer tube will then be pressed up against the bolt, and the 2-part epoxy will fill in the voids in the stock and in the bottom of the buffer tube where the normal stock lugs go.
Last edited by backbencher on Wed Jun 04, 2014 7:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Tue Jun 03, 2014 5:05 pm

The current plan of attack is to use two orientations, like this:

Image

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Mon Jun 09, 2014 3:52 pm

Today's work. This design can take up to 8 screws, 3 of which run the height of the butt.

Image

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Thu Jun 12, 2014 12:16 am

Image

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Fri Jun 13, 2014 3:37 pm

Image

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The very finest Harbor Freight Chinese Kragle was used, as usual. The threaded rods are from Lowe's - 6" 10-24 threaded rod. Production will probably be from Fastenall or Grainger.

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by stevebuscemi » Wed Jun 18, 2014 9:37 pm

Should let your kid bring that to school.

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Thu Jun 19, 2014 5:03 pm

With 8 threaded rods Kragled, and 2 part epoxy locking the buffer tube in against the top of 3 of the rods, 24 rounds of 3" 12 ga 00:

http://www.feinsteingewehrwerke.com/loe ... s003in.3gp

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Sat Jun 28, 2014 3:00 am

Here's the initial draft of the instruction manual:

http://www.feinsteingewehrwerke.com/loe ... sVer1.html

I'll get a proper parts list up in a week or so. The threaded rods are 10-24 - I'll try to get the metric equivalents, as well as the exactish length measurements they need to be cut to.

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Wed Jul 02, 2014 6:15 pm

Some pics of Effort Forend:

Image

Image

Heat shield isn't installed in the brick lower handguard, and they're not glued.

http://www.feinsteinproject.org/loes/ef ... orend.html

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by Eek » Wed Jul 02, 2014 8:49 pm

Will the ABS melt?

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Wed Jul 02, 2014 9:29 pm

That remains the problem w/ the handguard. Typical AR handguards are aluminum, or high temperature plastics. There's also an aluminum heat shield that goes between the plastic and the bbl. I don't have one of those inserted at the moment on the bottom brick handguard, as I was just trying to see if it would fit, and if it would stay in position unglued. I"m quite sure a number of pieces would fall off of it right now if I fired it - though I have an idea of gluing 1x1 bricks or bbls on the ends, and holding all the rest of the structure under compression - and flexible. The stock kit, however, is stable once glued, and in production.

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Wed Aug 06, 2014 5:45 pm

Revised instructions for the Mk8 entry length stock. Broken down into 21 pages for easier viewing:

http://www.feinsteingewehrwerke.com/loe ... Ver1A.html

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by stevebuscemi » Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:24 pm

Can you make a version that will pass metal detectors?

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Re: First pics of the brick AR-15 stock

Post by backbencher » Fri Aug 08, 2014 11:23 am

stevebuscemi wrote:Can you make a version that will pass metal detectors?
If it's not glued together, I don't see what the TSA is going to say about a collection of plastic bricks & some threaded 10-24 rods. Once it's glued, it's a rifle stock, and should be shipped in your checked luggage. An X-Ray or physical search is going to see the 1" diameter threaded aluminum AR buffer tube sticking out of the stock rather clearly, as you can see on the last page of the instructions: http://www.feinsteingewehrwerke.com/loe ... APg21.html

Defense Distributed designed a 3-D printed plastic pistol that could evade metal detectors, albeit a metal detector turned up to the highest setting will still detect metal bullets. As they printed theirs, they added the requisite piece of metal to meet Federal law. The point of the Feinstein Project http://www.feinsteinproject.org/ is not to make an undetectable firearm - it's to make a working AR lower receiver, that would still require a metal barrel to contain the 50,000 PSI pressures of .223" Remington ammunition.

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